Date: Fri, 2 Jul 93 04:00:11 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #121 Kraftwerk Digest Fri, 2 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 121 Today's Topics: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #120 New KW themes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 1 Jul 93 13:48:03 -0700 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #120 To: kraftwerk Really-From: karty@cs.washington.edu (Richard Karty) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Anyone an idea what the philosophy (oops) behind the name > Electric Cafe is? I can come up with a few of my own, but My guess is that they chose words that are understood almost globally. "Cafe" can hardly be considered a specifically French word anymore, and "electric" or some variation is probably common to all Romance, Germanic and Slavic languages, and recognizable elsewhere. Sort of global-village-ish, although I don't think Kraftwerk are quite that naive. I get the same impression from the title of the Elektric Music album, "Esperanto". Richard ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 Jul 1993 09:06:14 -0600 (MDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: New KW themes To: kraftwerk Really-From: Lazlo Nibble Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Maybe they're waiting for new technology to be developed so they can > produce an album about it... If they try to do an album about "virtual reality" and other trendy edgetech I *will* vomit. -- Lazlo (lazlo@triton.unm.edu) There's so much noise, I can't hear the music! What orchestra IS this? ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Sat, 3 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #122 Kraftwerk Digest Sat, 3 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 122 Today's Topics: 'Electric Cafe' Equipment New album (4 msgs) Run out of themes?? Verify (fwd) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1993 11:53:42 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: 'Electric Cafe' To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Gabriel Yedid > I asked a question once about this album, and only got one answer which > let me down a little. We're all to blame. > Where (actually how) does E. Cafe fit in to KW's aggregate? As I've mentioned before, E.Cafe is KWish in the sense of producing the ultimate in electronic music. The abortion of the LP 'Technopop' is an evidence about this. The 3 songs that appear on 'The Remix' bootleg CD and are supposed to be from that aborted LP are a good example of this. They probably prefered to wait 3 years more to release really sth. technologically stunning rather than release sth. that would be the average techno thing. > It's the only KW album I've heard aside from The Mix. You should rush and borrow/buy the other albums, ASAP! > Janne said overall > it seems to have been a bust, but it seems, nevertheless, to have left its > mark on this list, especially on Jose! :) So it can't be all that bad. It was a bit a let down after the strongly conceptual album C.World (which by the way is really great, get it, Gabe!) Probably people expected another conceptual album. Added to this, the gap between C.World and E.Cafe is 5 years!!! Now that I think about it, E.Cafe was not so conceptual. In a way it's a comeback, as it creates an atmosphere of sound, without an everyday technological concept (no computers, no trains, ...) This is seen (*heard*) in the first 3 tracks of E.Cafe: B.B.Tschak, T.Pop, M.N.Stop. They form one long track, and they not exactly easy listening techno thing. Not commercial (opposite to T.Call, S.Object). It's quite difficult to get into it (it was *very* difficult for me to get into it in fact), but the sounds are amazing. A stunning piece of electronic music. An extract from an article about KW from the mag. Record Collector is an excellent description: "The music was uncompromising, especially on side 1 which seemed to take the band's minimalism to the outer reaches and wasn't likely to convert the uninitiated. Further examination, however, revealed the album to be not only technically stunning, but also a complex interweaving of rhythm, sound manipulation, treated voices and melody." There's still a clear reference to the everyday technological objects: telephones (T. Call). The remixed version that appeared on the b-side of the single T.Call is a *great* rhythmic track: Housephone. If you ever have the chance to get the single, don't miss it. > where can I order a good copy of it? (I only HEARD the album--didn't buy > it though.) It's available in the US from Elektra, 9 25525-2. And if you get it complete with its "full picture" longbox, the better. Well, the continous references to it on my signatures are just because it's the only KW album where some of their message is in Spanish :) I know it's the favourite album for some other people from this list, eh Lutz? Anyone else? Jose Garcia "La musica ideas portara y siempre continuara, pepe@ctivax.uab.es sonido electronico, decibel sintetico" -Technopop- ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Jul 1993 00:50:42 -0400 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Equipment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Tina Marie LeMarier Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu In this months Keyboard magazine there is a review of an analog-style sequencer that was "Developed in Germany in consultation with members of Kraftwerk". It's called the Doepfer MAQ 16/3. It has 3 rows of 16 potentiometers that can run in either a serial, parellel or random fashion. It seems kind of neat, but I could think of better ways to spend my musicall dollars. I was looking through a a couple of old issues of Keyboard and was reminded of the time that they had one issue that had 5 pages on Kraftwerk and in the next issue they had 13 pages on the keyboard work in the Grateful Dead. Give me a break! Shane ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 Jul 1993 15:34:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: New album To: kraftwerk Really-From: +46 21 193000 Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193000 93-07-02 15.34 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET Long time ago Ralf Hutter said in an interview that HE wanted to do "biological music". Appearently this wasn't what Florian wanted... I don't think they are lacking ideas of new themes, nor musical ideasThey are such perfectionists (remember all remixes of E.C. before it was finally released) that they prefer to work on the material until they are pleased. EMI are not at all pleased with that attitude... One must also remember that Kraftwerk works with other things than just music, that can also contribute to the long gaps between their records. In an interview 1991, Hutter said that "Kraftwerk is working on new material, but we can't say when it will come out." Hopefully will Elektric Music push them to release something in the near future, some of the material on Esperanto, like Overdrive seems to be "anti-produced", rough but interesting... /anders ********************************************************************* * Anders Wilhelm, at my summerjob, forgot my .sig in Umea... * ********************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: 2 Jul 93 14:11:00 GMT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: New album To: kraftwerk Really-From: rmb@cblph.att.com Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu >One must also remember that Kraftwerk works with other things than >just music, that can also contribute to the long gaps between their >records. Like what? I've always wondered what things they might be involved in besides music. Rich... { Rich Brack /-/ _ i don't want to be your angel } { rmb@cblph.att.com /-/ _|_|_ i want to be your witch! } { \-\/-/ ( * )tch -yello } { \/\/ /^\ } ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1993 17:03:18 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: New album To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: +46 21 193000 > I don't think they are lacking ideas of new themes, nor musical >ideas. Hope you're right! > They are such perfectionists... Yes, that's very true. > In an interview 1991, Hutter said that "Kraftwerk is working on new > material, but we can't say when it will come out." Florian told to me and other fans, about one month ago, they were not playing any new stuff in none of the 3 concerts because they didn't want it to be available on bootleg before they actually released it on an album. It makes a lot of sense. > /anders Jose Garcia ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1993 12:17:38 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: New album To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu What, according to Ralf, is "biological music"? Something less electronic and produced with more human involvement, like the stuff on R&F? (Or how about this: an album, devoted completely to biotech (CYBERPUNK biotech), with, as Janne suggested, cover art by Giger, and KW dressed up as...BORG from Star Trek :) ) And what's in this "biological music" that so turned Florian off? Is it using sampled sounds of rhythms from the human body (e.g., heartbeats, stomach movements, etc.)? That would be pretty cool, actually! Gabe. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1993 11:23:09 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Run out of themes?? To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Bruce_M._Lloyd@magic-bbs.corp.apple.com > I wouldn't care if they came out with an album about food. As long as they > produced an album! Yes. Neither would I. Maybe they could use the sound of electric mixers ;) No, seriously. Don't think it's very KWish. > Really-From: Where is my mind? > I think that one of the main reasons why Kraftwerk wouldn't come out with > something new at this point is because there are so many techno/industrial/ > house/acid/KW clones out there and KW might feel that their new stuff > would become thrown together in that same category. Yes. I think the same. The main reason for the gap between C.World and E.Cafe was probably that. The aborted Technopop album wouldn't have brought any new sounds or ways of making electronic music, so they just waited another 3 years and came up with sth. really new: E.Cafe > I believe that unless they can come out with something that would differen- > tiate themselves from the glut of techo/electric crap that is out there > right now, then they wouldn't bother to enter the market again right now. Yeah. See above. > Really-From: Eric > There were plenty of same back when EC came out, not to mention The MIX. Yes, but far from the KW sound. And these band don't bring new ideas: "Music will bring (new) ideas and will continue forever. Electronic sound, synthetic dB" (translation from the verse sung in Spanish in "Technopop"). That's what E.Cafe does: bring (new) ideas, sounds, textures, ways of making rhythm. > Very little that comes out is ever unique or creative, IMHO. I have every > confidence that Kraftwerk could create another musical revolution. Yes. Maybe they don't want to create another musical revolution, but certainly to produce sth. different, new sounds, ... > Really-From: Terre Thaemlitz > Kraftwerk made it big first and was > dubbed the "leader" of other groups which had independently been working > toward similar goals for a long time. And I think KW was eagerly part of a > global movement, not a musical monopoly. Well, I think they have alway wanted to keep apart from any movement, or at least to be at the top of it. > Really-From: Bruce_M._Lloyd@magic-bbs.corp.apple.com > Maybe they're waiting for new technology to be developed so they can > produce an album about it... I hope that's not the case :) Anyway, the thing is their themes have always been about everyday objects and technology, not about outer-space technology. I do think they won't come out with a new album unless they're sure to stand out from the rest of techno bands. Jose Garcia ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1993 20:01:18 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Verify (fwd) To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I originally sent this message to Jose concerning a sound experiment I did with e-music in physics class; I guess everyone can read it now. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 2 Jul 1993 12:24:53 -500 (EDT) From: Gabriel Yedid To: Jose Garcia Subject: Re: Verify Before I post this message to the list, maybe I should describe it to you: Last week, we were playing with oscilloscopes in physics class. I noticed that the wave generators used were audio sources, and that by hooking up mikes to the scope inputs we could see vocal waveforms. I decided that I would try out something--I wanted to see the waveforms of different kinds of e-music. So I made a tape of some stuff at home, brought in a player, and tried it out. Here's what I found: Beaubourg (Vangelis): not what I had expected. Although this "music" is very bad-sounding, the waveforms it produced were surprisingly round and gentle. I had been expecting something closer to square waves from this. Rendez-Vous V (Jean-Michel Jarre): again, very round waveforms, but a more complex interaction between the different synths than on the Vangelis piece. Very strong bass which looked surprisingly "real"; like an acoustical bass sound. Music for Airports (Brian Eno): VERY round and gentle waves (it was the a cappella section of side 1). Nothing had an amplitude of more than 4 cm. The Robots & Music Non Stop (Kraftwerk): these were different. The waves were much more jagged than anything I had observed previously, even approaching square in many areas, particularly in The Robots. Music Non Stop was harder to read because of its pulsing rhythm and excessive use of reverberating sounds (the decay was noticeably different than in the Vangelis), but my teacher remarked that the synths had a strange "metallic" quality that he had not heard in the other pieces. ----->These were The Mix's remix versions. So this is why I need to know about KW's synths. Just by the sound, I get the idea that they aren't too big on things that Jarre uses as standard synths, such as the Prophets, Fairlights, ARPs and Oberheims (also, Jarre custom modifies many of his synths and has others specially designed). But KW does seem to have a much "harder", less ephemeral sound than other e-music artists. If those names (on The Mix) are their synths (or synth manufacturers), then this, I think, would say something about the qualities of European synths as compared to American (or, in the case of the Fairlight, Australian) ones. Gabe. ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Sun, 4 Jul 93 04:00:09 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #123 Kraftwerk Digest Sun, 4 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 123 Today's Topics: New Sales list ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 3 Jul 1993 22:37:56 +0200 (MET DST) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: New Sales list To: kraftwerk Really-From: bombuzal Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu TANGERINE DREAM, KRAFTWERK AND KLAUS SCHULZE SALESLIST ------------------------------------------------------ DATE : 3 JULY 1993 price code TANGERINE DREAM --------------- - In den Garten Pharaos/Bicycle Race CD F Live Bristol 6-11-90 75 min. - Dreaming on Danforth Avenue CD G Live Toronto 4-10-93 - Antarktis CD G Live Reichstag Berlin 1987 - Mystery Tracks : Flashpoint + CD G Quinoa ( Live at the Cave, Berlin ) - Voices in the Dunes BOOK K The Tangerine Dream worldwide discography 464 pages - Staatsgrenze West ( White cover ) EX/- LP G Live im Palast der Republik 31-1-1980 - Electronic Meditation EX/EX LP J FR, 1976, FOC, Virgin 2401 722, Red/Silver labels - Flashpoint EX/EX LP E USA, 1984, EMI 2402381 - Das Madchen auf der Treppe/Flock EX/EX 12" E GER, 1982, Virgin 600651-213 - Heartbreakers EX/G Cutout LP E GER, 1985, Virgin 207 202-620 - Wavelength EX/M LP F UK, 1983, Varese STV 81207 - Quichotte M/M LP H Live im Palast der Republik 31-1-1980 DDR, 1980, Amiga 855819 Blue labels - Quichotte EX/EX LP F - Bicycle Race LP G Live Bristol 6-11-90. In 3 different colours - Warsaw in the sun 7" K Shaped Picture Single, 1985, Jivep 74 - The Canyon Dreams EX/EX LP K Bootleg with music from the Video 1987, Multicoloured vinyl KRAFTWERK --------- - Book 'Man, Machine and Music' by Paul Bussy BOOK F 200 pages biography with nice photos ( NEW ) - Discography. BOOKLET B Most complete Kraftwerk discograpy available. With nice radio-activity cover - Sellafield. VHS-PAL F Official Greenpeace VHS tape of the Sellafield concert against radio-activity. Featuring Kraftwerk. VHS-PAL tape only for Europe - Live Dusseldorf Philipshalle 31-10-91 2CD L - Rebuilt in '91 (same music as above) 2CD L - The Remix CD G Lots of Razormaid and other remixes - Nippon Numbers CD G Live Tokyo 7-9-1981 - Virtu Ex Machina (same music as above) CD G - Computers in Love 2CD L Live Belgium 1981 - Hyper Cerebral Machine CD G Live Firenze Italy 19-5-1981 Sound quality is not good, only for completists - Heute abend. Live UK 1991 2CD L Live Grassina 9-2-1990 Sound quality is not good, only for completists - Musique Non Stop NEW 12" E CAN, 1986, Warner. Still Sealed - Neonlights VG/EX 12" I UK, 1978, Vertigo. On Luminous vinyl - Neonlights EX/EX 12" J - Doppelalbum - Compilation EX/EX LP2 K GER, 1974, Philips 6623057 - Same ( Kraftwerk 1 + Kraftwerk 2 ) EX/EX LP2 M UK, 1974, Vertigo 6641077 - Ralf & Florian EX/EX LP I USA, 1974, Vertigo VEL 2006 - Autobahn/Morning Walk EX/- 7" F USA, 1974, Vertigo VE 203 ( No picture sleeve ) - Tour De France/Remix EX/- 7" F USA, 1984, Warner 7-29342 PROMO - Kometenmelodie 2 / Mitternacht EX/- 7" J GER, 1974, Philips 6003466 KLAUS SCHULZE ------------- - Floating CD K Live Vereeniging Nijmegen 21-11-1982 Very rare Schulze CD bootleg, sorry for the price OTHER RELATED MUSICIANS/GROUPS ------------------------------ - Ash Ra Tempel - Join Inn EX/G LP M GER, 1972, Ohr OMM 556032 - Ash Ra Tempel - Schwingungen EX/EX Cutout LP O GER, 1972, FOC, Ohr OMM 556020 - Ash Ra Tempel - Rosi LP G FR, 1973, PDU 840.101 Quadrophonic - Ambient Synthetiseur BOX with 3 limited edition picture discs NEW CD3 M Froese-Aqua/Schulze-Timewind/Ashra-Blackouts 1990 Virgon TPAK 12 Price codes HFL DM US$ UKL A 5 4.50 3 2 B 10 9 6 4 C 15 13.50 8.50 6 D 20 18 11.50 7.50 E 25 22.50 14.50 9.50 F 30 27 17 11 G 35 31.50 20 13 H 40 36 23 15 I 45 40.50 26 17 J 50 45 28.50 18.50 K 60 54 34.50 22.50 L 65 58.50 37 24 M 70 63 40 26 N 80 72 46 30 O 90 81 51.50 33.50 P 100 90 57 37 Postage by air mail SAL (AUS,CAN,NZ) US$ 1CD 4 4 3 4 2CD 4 4 4 5 3CD 5 5 6 8 4CD 5 5 8 8 5CD 8 8 10 12.50 Postage is not included in the prices. All items are new unless stated elsewhere. Gradings for vinyl items are first for record, second for sleeve. GRADINGS -------- New - Never played M - Mint - Almost perfect, played only a few times EX - Excellent - Little bit of noise or very small scratches G - Good - More noise and irritating scratches For orders please contact me on Internet : bombuzal@hacktic.nl Don't send any money before I confirmed your order. Payment can be done in the next ways, and in NO other. - Offer me some nice electronic material in exchange, we might come to an exchange with no money involved at all. Ask for my searchlist if you have some interesting items to offer. I am always interested in buying or swapping interesting electronic items. - Send me money ( your local currency ) in a registered letter ( with an insured value, if the parcel gets lost at the PTT, you can reclaim all the money ). - Send me an International Money Order ( available at your local Post office ). An IMO can take up to 4 weeks to reach me, so be patient with this variant. - In Europe you can send me a Eurocheque in HFL ( Dutch Guilders ). - You can make a giral transfer ( If that's possible from your country ). In this case you must add Hfl 6.50 for the extra expenses I will get. Peter van Dam ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Mon, 5 Jul 93 04:00:09 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #124 Kraftwerk Digest Mon, 5 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 124 Today's Topics: NEW MATERIAL!! Verify (fwd) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 05 Jul 1993 08:16:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: NEW MATERIAL!! To: kraftwerk Really-From: +46 21 193000 Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193000 93-07-05 08.16 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET Last Friday, on MTV-news, Kraftwerks anti-Sellafield 2 video was announced. It is a 5 minute video that they have done to stop the construction of Sellafield 2. They showed a 1 minute clip from the video. No music, just a vocoder with a political statement :-), in the background was something resembling the noise in "Voice of Energy". They also had a "breath-choir" chord breaking in now and then. I will transcribe the text until tomorrow. I was supprised that it seemed to be very hastenly done. Hopefully they will show the whole video in a few weeks time. /anders ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Jul 93 15:09:17 CDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Verify (fwd) To: kraftwerk Really-From: dacc@cmp-rt.music.uiuc.edu (Andrew C. Crowell) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Previously, kraftwerk mailing list wrote: > > Really-From: Gabriel Yedid > > Last week, we were playing with oscilloscopes in physics class. I > noticed that the wave generators used were audio sources, and that by > hooking up mikes to the scope inputs we could see vocal waveforms. I > decided that I would try out something--I wanted to see the waveforms of > different kinds of e-music. So I made a tape of some stuff at home, > brought in a player, and tried it out. Here's what I found: > > Beaubourg (Vangelis): not what I had expected. Although this "music" is > very bad-sounding, the waveforms it produced were surprisingly round and > gentle. I had been expecting something closer to square waves from this. Won't get 'em, nope. "Beauborg" is done on a Moog modular system, if I remember correctly, and Vangelis uses lots of filtering throughout the work to shape and alter the sounds. So, consequently, even if there were squarewaves present, they're going to be rounded-off by having their harmonic content altered by the often-extreme filtering in the work. > > Rendez-Vous V (Jean-Michel Jarre): again, very round waveforms, but a > more complex interaction between the different synths than on the Vangelis > piece. Very strong bass which looked surprisingly "real"; like an > acoustical bass sound. More analog stuff here, for the most part. Jarre was using a Fairlight by this time, but not using a lot of FM-type synthesis on it. He mainly used the device as something of a sampler at this point, or as a master-controlling sequencer. > > Music for Airports (Brian Eno): VERY round and gentle waves (it was the a > cappella section of side 1). Nothing had an amplitude of more than 4 cm. Not electronic sounds here, as such. Eno's using tape loops of human voices, so what you're going to get on this are the typical formant curves one finds with human vowel sounds. > > The Robots & Music Non Stop (Kraftwerk): these were different. The waves > were much more jagged than anything I had observed previously, even > approaching square in many areas, particularly in The Robots. Music Non > Stop was harder to read because of its pulsing rhythm and excessive use of > reverberating sounds (the decay was noticeably different than in the > Vangelis), but my teacher remarked that the synths had a strange "metallic" > quality that he had not heard in the other pieces. > ----->These were The Mix's remix versions. > > So this is why I need to know about KW's synths. Just by the sound, > I get the idea that they aren't too big on things that Jarre uses as > standard synths, such as the Prophets, Fairlights, ARPs and Oberheims > (also, Jarre custom modifies many of his synths and has others specially > designed). But KW does seem to have a much "harder", less ephemeral sound > than other e-music artists. If those names (on The Mix) are their synths (or > synth manufacturers), then this, I think, would say something about the > qualities of European synths as compared to American (or, in the case of > the Fairlight, Australian) ones. Well, when I listened to "The Mix", I noticed the "metallic" sound, too...and immediately associated it with typical FM synthesis engines, such as the Yamaha DX-series, but there are other things which will do this sound admirably, one being the NED Synclavier...and there is one in their equipment compliment. As for the envelope qualities, Kraftwerk uses a much more percussive sound in most places than the artists you listed above, so the viewed envelopes are going to have not a sloped-type curve, but a very clipped-looking one, as there is an abrupt attack, and a frequently- truncated decay (sometimes, just an on-off envelope, even). It's not so much a difference in synthesizers that you're dealing with here, though, it's far moreso a difference in programming and in programming methodology. What KW is trying to do is music with hard, clipped beats and bright, punchy sounds...as opposed to the above artists, for the most part. A better comparison to "The Mix" would be something by Orbital, Moby, or such...the better names in techno/house music. You'll find some major similarities in scope traces when you compare KW with those, I would figure. D.A.C. Crowell Computer Music Project/School of Music University of Illinois at Urbana/Champaign (dacc@cmp-rt.music.uiuc.edu) -- ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Tue, 6 Jul 93 04:00:08 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #125 Kraftwerk Digest Tue, 6 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 125 Today's Topics: Current Projex (2 msgs) Elektric Music Single (2 msgs) Future music (was Run Out Of Themes?) New album NEW MATERIAL!! New Sales list Verify (fwd) (3 msgs) Wanted: 'Computer Tour' live cd ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 05 Jul 93 15:43:48 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Current Projex To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu In message <199303120315.AA07361@cs.uwp.edu> you write: > Really-From: John Guscott > > DOes anyone have any information on any new projex by members of Kraftwerk? I browsed thru some old messages, and among these a project of Florian Schneider was mentioned, called 'Alice in Wonderland'. Another name for a project of his, but I don't remember where I heard it, is 'Solaria' or something. Does this ring a bell with anyone? -Rick -- rick@sara.nl ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Jul 1993 09:19:29 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Current Projex To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Rick Jansen > I browsed thru some old messages, and among these a project > of Florian Schneider was mentioned, called 'Alice in Wonderland'. I was told about this project some time ago, but it seems it has nothing to do with the Florian we know. It's supposedly by another Florian. Jose Garcia pepe@ctivax.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 93 10:06:06 BST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Elektric Music Single To: kraftwerk Really-From: Al Crawford Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I think someone might have posted something about this a while back but - is there to be a single to accompany the "domestic" (ie everywhere except those countries covered by SPV) release of Elektric Music's _Esperanto_? I seem to remember somebody saying something about this and I'd like to check before getting hold of an import copy of "T.V." - no point in paying over the odds for it if I'll be able to get it at regular price. Al -- Al Crawford - awrc@dcs.ed.ac.uk Department Of Computer Science, The University of Edinburgh Rm 1410, JCMB, Kings Buildings, Mayfield Rd, EDINBURGH, EH9 3JZ, Scotland Tel: +44 (0) 31 650 5165 Fax: +44 (0) 31 667 7209 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 11:38:32 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Elektric Music Single To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Al Crawford > is there to be a single to accompany the "domestic" (ie everywhere except > those countries covered by SPV) release of Elektric Music's _Esperanto_? The release of _Esperanto_ in UK and other countries was supposed to by accompanied by the release of a single, supposedly _TV_. I cannot confirm that. Check out in a record store. Or maybe someone else knows for sure... Jose Garcia "Este es un programa de television espan~ola" pepe@ctivax.uab.es -TV- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 93 12:49:39 EDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Future music (was Run Out Of Themes?) To: kraftwerk Really-From: Ravi=Shah%ADMIN%910LSK@vinesfs1.anes.upmc.edu Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu D.A. has a good point about coming "full-circle". In general, how do we know what type of music will be made in 20 years? It it so logical that everything's going to return to analog? I really don't know the answer to this. I'm sure there have been attempts to quantify musical styles over time into some sort of graph. What do people think about this? Will we be holding lyrettes like Spock? (chuckle) Ravi Shah shah+@pitt.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 93 11:23:30 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: New album To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > What, according to Ralf, is "biological music"? Something less > electronic and produced with more human involvement, like the stuff on R&F? Technopop was, according to Hutter, an album to 'celebrate the human body'. Muscles, cycling, sport and the lot. Hence, I guess, Tour de France. Perhaps they couldn't find any tasteful bodily sounds after the groans in Tour de France? Come to think of it, I wouldn't know any tasteful bodily sound :-) Rick Jansen -- rick@sara.nl The young man stepped into the Hall of Modules... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 13:57:33 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: NEW MATERIAL!! To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu What exactly is this Sellafield? (It's the only "locale" on the remixed Radioactivity I'm not familiar with.) Gabe. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 93 11:33:52 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: New Sales list To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > - Computers in Love 2CD L > Live Belgium 1981 Hela, staat de Utrechtse 'Metropolis' niet op deze cd ook? Als dat zo is mag ik 'm dan reserveren? :) Oh, en ik heb t boek ook nog niet, dus dat wil ik ook graag van je hebben. > - Offer me some nice electronic material in exchange, we might come to an > exchange with no money involved at all. Ask for my searchlist if you have > some interesting items to offer. Stuur die lijst maar eens. -Rick. -- rick@sara.nl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 11:31:04 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Verify (fwd) To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu There's one thing that might be the reflex of the sound complexity of KW, and that amazes me: When I look at the surface of the vinyl of, for instance C.World or E.Cafe, I see a very complex form in the grooves. I hope you get what I mean, my English is very limited! Jose Garcia "One, two, one; two, four, two" pepe@ctivax.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jul 1993 13:52:27 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Verify (fwd) To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I think for Rendez-Vous, Jarre was using his custom-built Matrisequencer (I am not certain just how this device differs from a "regular" sequencer). As for his Fairlight, I wouldn't know. The only synth I can identify by sound is the Prophet 5. (There was also a Prophet used in Rendez-Vous, but the model wasn't specified. The Fairlight may at this point have been a Fairlight 2.) I am particularly interested in the synth combos that KW was using to produce that buzzy-sounding beat on Electric Cafe (MnS's album). Gabe. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Jul 93 10:12:33 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Verify (fwd) To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Just a note: you cannot just view music on an oscilloscope without some filtering if you're interested in the shape of a specific sound. If you just view it the bassier sounds will obscure anything and just give you a wobbly picture. A regular scope isn't a very good instrument to get an idea of music anyway, the screen is too narrow, you can't see enough 'periods' of a sound to detect a pattern. Rick. -- rick@sara.nl She's a module and she's sounding good ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 05 Jul 93 14:13:47 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Wanted: 'Computer Tour' live cd To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Well, the subject says it all, I'd like to obtain the Computer Tour bootl... ehm.. cd's. Anyone with a spare? A nice gift for the good seller will be returned. -- rick@sara.nl She's a module and she's looking good ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #126 Kraftwerk Digest Wed, 7 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 126 Today's Topics: sounds in KW ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 6 Jul 93 10:35:15 EDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: sounds in KW To: kraftwerk Really-From: eric@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu (Eric J. Hansen) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu As for this recent quote about KW's sounds versus those from other techno bands -- > sounds...as opposed to the above artists, for the most part. A better > comparison to "The Mix" would be something by Orbital, Moby, or such...the > better names in techno/house music. You'll find some major similarities > in scope traces when you compare KW with those, I would figure. Sure you'll find lots of similarities here, as well as in a host of other techno... if you look closely, you'll notice that they're EXACTLY the same!!! Sampling! Those vultures... It's really disappointing to hear the first few seconds of The Robots (the frequency sweeps) at a dance club, only to find out that the song to follow is not KW, but Depeche Mode or the like... Eric *---------------------------------------------------------------------* | Eric J. Hansen .................... eric@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu | | Center for Clinical Computing .......... Boston, MA (617) 732-5925 | | .... DOS/Mac programming, Ultrix administration, general chaos .... | *---------------------------------------------------------------------* ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 04:00:08 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #127 Kraftwerk Digest Thu, 8 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 127 Today's Topics: Sellafield (3 msgs) virtual reality ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 7 Jul 93 15:58:37 METDST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sellafield To: kraftwerk Really-From: "H." Boorsma Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Grabriel asks: What is Sellafield ? Well, there are 2 ways to get an answer: 1. Watch MTV News and look at the KW clip 2. Wait a few years and keep looking to CNN. They'll let you know when the nuclear plant in Sellafield (UK) has let out yet another vast amount of radioactive material. (I wouldn't like to make political statements here, but as a student of applied physics I think that*ANY* risk with nuclear material should be avoided. Companies like the one in sellafield that actually put radioactive waste into the environment, should not be allowed to continue their buisiness) But, remember, as long as the 2nd law of thermodynamics holds, there's NO way to stop radioactivity ! Hillebrand ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1993 14:15:38 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sellafield To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu How are we supposed to stop something that has been pounding the planet since it formed? From both space and from the Sun? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Jul 1993 08:00:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sellafield To: kraftwerk Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193000 93-07-08 08.00 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET How are we supposed to stop something that has been pounding the planet since it formed? From both space and from the Sun? I am not at all against the use of nuclear energy. But there are a lot of radioactive substances is man-made which doesn't occur normally in nature. The most harmful being plutonium, over 90% in nature has been manufactured this century. Plants like Sellafield contribute a lot to the spread of plutonium, cesium. But Sellafield is by no means the most concerning plant in Europe. In the Baltic lies Ignalina, the worlds largest nuclear power plant. My uncle, who works in the ASEA nuclear division, has been there and he told me that the saftey can be compared with plants in sweden in the fifties. The reactortype in Ignalina is the same as in Tjernobyl, graphitemoderated, but a lot bigger. I think that Kraftwerk is aiming at the wrong direction, the plants in east Europe is a much bigger threat than Sellafield. /anders - "I press the key, and watch TV" ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Jul 1993 12:49:53 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: virtual reality To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Lazlo Nibble > If they try to do an album about "virtual reality" and other trendy edgetech > I *will* vomit. I don't think they would use this as a theme, but use it as another media to use in their show. In fact, their shows are kind of virtual reality. You find yourself travelling into a car on the autobahn, you "feel" the trains... Musique non stop is a kind of "virtual irreality" I'd say. A new musical world. Jose Garcia pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #128 Kraftwerk Digest Fri, 9 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 128 Today's Topics: Sellafield (2 msgs) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 8 Jul 93 13:14:33 BST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sellafield To: kraftwerk Really-From: Peter Cassidy Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Grabriel asks: > > What is Sellafield ? > > (I wouldn't like to make political statements here, but > as a student of applied physics I think that*ANY* risk with > nuclear material should be avoided. Companies like > the one in sellafield that actually put radioactive > waste into the environment, should not be allowed to > continue their buisiness) > I agree wholeheartedly with the above statement. Sellafield (was Windscale, but the name was changed after an 'incident') is on the west coast of Wales. I live 50 miles away in Ireland, and this power station is a constant threat. It has a notorious reputation for leakage into the sea and as a result, the Irish Sea has been described as the most radioactive sea in the world. 'nuff said !! OBKraftwerk : Doesn't KW mean 'Power plant' in German ?? What are the names, other than Sellafield, of the other places mentioned in 'Radioactivity' from The Mix album?? -- Regards, Peter ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- | M O T O R O L A B . V . I R E L A N D | | ----------------------------------------- | | Peter Cassidy - T.S.E Dublin | Phone : 353-1-840-8866 Ext. 417 | | MACCVM : C10404 | X400 : peterc@comm.mot.com | ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Jul 1993 14:42:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sellafield To: kraftwerk Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193000 93-07-08 14.42 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET Doesn't KW mean 'Power plant' in German ?? What are the names, other than Sellafield, of the other places mentioned in 'Radioactivity' from The Mix album?? Radioactivity: "Tjernobyl, Harrisburg, Sellafield, Hiroshima" Has anyone seen any more of the anti-Sellafield video than the short bit they showed on MTV? /anders ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Sat, 10 Jul 93 04:00:13 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #129 Kraftwerk Digest Sat, 10 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 129 Today's Topics: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #128 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 9 Jul 93 14:13:58 BST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #128 To: kraftwerk Really-From: humphrys aj Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu HI there ! Could you please delete me fro mthe list, as I am going home for the summer ! thanks btw, Sellafield is in England !! ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #130 Kraftwerk Digest Mon, 12 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 130 Today's Topics: Die Dominas (2 msgs) Sellafield ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 11 Jul 1993 12:38:23 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Die Dominas To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Some digests ago, there was a discussion about the involvement of KW in the Die Dominas project. Here's some info from a magazine, probably called Dreams Word XI (??, I was sent just a photocopy). It features an interview with Manuel Gottsching, from Ash Ra Tempel. "DW: What about the project 'Die Dominas'? It seems that Kraftwerk helped with this project, or is this just a rumor? MG: 'Die Dominas' were two old friends of mine. They are my long time friend Rosi, who also performed on some Ash Ra Tempel records (...) and Claudia Skoda for whose fashion shows I have been composing and performing most of the music since 1976. They knew KW from Duesseldorf because they often went there together for fashion fairs. Ralf H. and Karl B. wrote down two special chords for them on a piece of paper: the "sub Domina" and the "Domina seven" (Domina = dominant) chords. Later in Berlin they were asking me to show them how these chords sounded. So, one evening when we were doing a nice long session together in my studio, I played them these chords. I explained a little about the instruments in the studio, and they started experimenting with them, without knowing that I was already recording the session! It was really a hilarious session, and the voices sounded like we were having a party. The next day, I started re-mixing the material, and finally got three titles out of it! Claudia and Rosi were so impressed with the result they played it to Ralf and Karl. They were so taken by the recording they offered to make the cover for the album. It turned out to be a very nice cover that looked like a silhouette in black and yellow. The record was released at the end of 1980 on Claudia Skoda's own independent label "Fabrikneu" as a limited edition pressing of 2000 copies. It was a 10" LP that was played at 33rpm on one side and 45 on the other. It sold out quickly, and still receives occasional airplay to this day! ..." Info about the LP: rec: November / December 1980, Studio Roma, Berlin a) I bin a Domina (16'53) b1) Herr Ralfi und herr Karl (2'55) 2) Die Wespendomina (5'56) Rosi: Vocals, Organ Claudia Skoda: Vocals, Synth M.G.: Programming, Recording and Mix 1981, FABRIKNEU, No 666, Germany I think this solves the mistery! Jose Garcia pepe@ctivax.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 10:56:04 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Die Dominas To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Weeell, the only names sort of listed on the cover of Die Dominas are Hutter's and Bartos'. This combined with the fact that some sounds are extremely familiar, and the sound-signature at the end of the first (or was it the last?) track consisting of distorted and fading 'hutter hutter hutter, bartos bartos bartos' makes me still think it's their produkt, and not Gottschings. Rick Jansen -- rick@sara.nl "Call me stubburn, dah'ling" -Dame Edna ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 11 Jul 93 13:54:12 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sellafield To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > > Doesn't KW mean 'Power plant' in German ?? What are the names, other > than Sellafield, of the other places mentioned in 'Radioactivity' from > The Mix album?? *MAYBE* its handy, before people post, to read the digests of previous discussions. Especially for people new on the list. -Rick -- rick@sara.nl ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 04:00:09 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #131 Kraftwerk Digest Tue, 13 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 131 Today's Topics: About this song... asking questions (2 msgs) Die Dominas logo for the KW digest? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 06:51:32 -0400 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: About this song... To: kraftwerk Really-From: aa2243@freenet.lorain.oberlin.edu (John Kohlstrand) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu For an ordinary Kraftwerk song ID, I could probably just look at a FAQ or something. But this merely sounds like Kraftwerk, or a combination of Kraftwerk and Cybotron (Cybotron being very early Detroit techno (c. 1980) by Juan Atkins). The refrain seems to be ``technicolor.'' ``w-w-w-wide screens. w-w-w-wide screens. Technicolor. Technicolor.....'' Since its so KWish, I thought maybe someone here would know who did this song, and maybe where I could find it. THanks Kohlstrand -- _ __ ___Cybotron (aa2243@freenet.lorain.oberlin.edu)___ __ _ INDUSTRY. WOBC-FM 91.5 Oberlin, Ohio, USA ``The music is like Detroit, a complete mistake. It's Kraftwerk and George Clinton stuck in an elevator.'' -- Derrick May ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 93 10:28:22 BST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: asking questions To: kraftwerk Really-From: Peter Cassidy Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > > Doesn't KW mean 'Power plant' in German ?? What are the names, other > > than Sellafield, of the other places mentioned in 'Radioactivity' from > > The Mix album?? > > > *MAYBE* its handy, before people post, to read the digests > of previous discussions. Especially for people new on the list. Yeah, sorry I asked 8-( > > -Rick > -- > rick@sara.nl -- Regards, Peter ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- | M O T O R O L A B . V . I R E L A N D | | Peter Cassidy - T.S.E Dublin | Phone : 353-1-840-8866 Ext. 417 | | MACCVM : C10404 | X400 : peterc@comm.mot.com | ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 11:50:27 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: asking questions To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu / Really-From: Peter Cassidy /> > Doesn't KW mean 'Power plant' in German ?? What are the names, other /> > than Sellafield, of the other places mentioned in 'Radioactivity' from /> > The Mix album?? Yeah, good comment Peter, Kraftwerk against kraftwerks, weird! /> /> *MAYBE* its handy, before people post, to read the digests /> of previous discussions. Especially for people new on the list. You're also right Rick. I strongly recommend to new subscribers to get back issues of the digest. I've been told they're very enjoyable to read, right McDatman? Were are you? Jose Garcia pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 11:18:46 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Die Dominas To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Weeeell, I can't think of any reason why should Manuel Gottsching have not told the truth in this interview. It sounds rather truthful. The 'Hutter ... Bartos ...' chorus thing can just be a way of dedicating the track to them, as the original idea of it came from the two chords they wrote down. I don't happen to have a copy of this "Die Dominas" release. Anyone with a spare one? I guess no. Jose Garcia pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Jul 1993 15:31:59 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: logo for the KW digest? To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Dave "administrator" Datta says he can add a tail logo to the digest... so: what about adding it? Maybe the now missed Hillebrand's autobahn sign? And a quotation also? Thoughts from anyone? We could run a poll if necessary. Jose Garcia pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Wed, 14 Jul 93 04:00:11 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #132 Kraftwerk Digest Wed, 14 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 132 Today's Topics: album "N1 to Zurich" (2 msgs) Disappointment (2 msgs) Klaus Roed Klaus Roeder in Autobahn (3 msgs) Kraftwerk Digest V1 #131 Man Machine Disappointment ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 10:15:32 EDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: album "N1 to Zurich" To: kraftwerk Really-From: eric@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu (Eric J. Hansen) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Hi, Has anyone heard the KW bootleg "N1 to Zurich"? I just picked it up the other day at an import store here in Boston, MA. It was about $26. The sound quality is relatively good (the store rated it 8/10), but then again, this is the first bootleg of any artist which I have on CD. There are places on the album where you can hear people talking, etc. I must also say that the sound of the crowd clapping along to "Das Model" is really annoying. Anyways, are all the bootlegs pretty much like this? I mean, the songs on this album are minimally different (IMHO) than the album versions. I guess I'm somewhat dissapointed (especially for $26!) I can post a summary of the songs, label #, etc, etc if anyone is interested. I think the concert date was around 10/91. Eric *---------------------------------------------------------------------* | Eric J. Hansen .................... eric@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu | | Center for Clinical Computing .......... Boston, MA (617) 732-5925 | | .... DOS/Mac programming, Ultrix administration, general chaos .... | *---------------------------------------------------------------------* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 19:27:59 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: album "N1 to Zurich" To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: eric@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu (Eric J. Hansen) > Has anyone heard the KW bootleg "N1 to Zurich"? Yes, we've mentioned that bootleg in the list, a few times. It's quite a good bootleg as far as the sound quality concerns. > There are places on the album where you can hear people talking, etc. I must > also say that the sound of the crowd clapping along to "Das Model" is really > annoying. Anyways, are all the bootlegs pretty much like this? The sound quality of an "average bootleg" is worst than the quality you get in "N1 to Zurich", definitely. Florian himself recognised this bootleg is OK. > I mean, the > songs on this album are minimally different (IMHO) than the album versions. Yes. The problem with this bootleg is you don't have the entire concert. You'd definitely see (hear) differences in tracks such as 'Musique non stop' and 'Pocket calculator'. They improvise in these two songs. You can get the whole concert in the "Rebuilt in '92" CDs (2 volumes), but the sound quality is slightly worst than in "N1". Jose Garcia pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 14:17:20 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I took the time a few days ago to go over The Man Machine. I must prepare myself for a major flame-thrashing when I say I was not impressed. It sounds like it was recorded in somebody's garage. The Mix's version of The Robots is so far superior to the original that it does not merit expounding on in detail. The voices sound "too real" (as opposed to the more "programmed" sound on the Mix), the synth work is slovenly, and the timing of the Russian with the music is off. I'll take the remix ANYDAY. Spacelab and Metropolis did not excite me. They are very reminiscent of the Comet Melodies from Autobahn, which also put me to sleep. The Man MAchine (the song) was completely incomprehensible--at any speed. One bright spot: the Model. Finally, a KW song with LYRICS! I must now don my fire-retardant attire and pick up some liquid CO-2. Gabe. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1993 10:00:10 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Gabe, here are the flames! :-] ;-) > It sounds like it was recorded in somebody's garage. It was recorded 15 years ago!!! Another album that was recorded 15 years ago is, if I remember well, JMJ's Equinoxe. You cannot compare the sound of the Man Machine to the sound of The Mix! You have to put it in the right context. I remember I read in a book about techno music that the guy who wrote it said he saw the album in '78 in a sound equipment fair, as a test for the hi-tech HI-FI turntables and amplifiers of the time! I recommend you give it a try, and remember, it's a '78 recording. What other albums have you heard apart from The Mix and The Man Machine? If you still haven't got hold of Electric Cafe, you should! PS: I will unsubscribe from the list as our host will be disconnected from the net, as we're moving to another building. I don't know if I'll have access soon to the internet :-( I will be getting the digests up to the last day. If you want to tell me sth, try it sending a mail directly to me, not to the list, as I won't be in the interactive mode. "The number you have reached has been disconnected!" Jose Garcia "La musica ideas portara y siempre continuara, pepe@cti.uab.es sonido electronico, decibel sintetico" -Technopop- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 13:44:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Klaus Roed To: kraftwerk Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193000 93-07-13 13.44 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET > Can anyone answer this? My guess is they have just changed the > credits 'mistakenly' or sth. I think they re-recorded Autobahn exactly as it was, but that they played the guitar and violin and percussion themselves now. Thus it wasn't necessary any longer to mention Roeder, or Fluer for that matter. They also rewrote the lyrics as not having to mention Schult too! Did they really re-record the album? I thought that it was only a remix of the original tape. Anyway, I have allways woundered what happened to Klaus Roeder after the Autobahn album. Has anyone got any music of him? /anders - "Transformator Station, Artistic collaboration, Futuristic technology, Cybernetic laboratory." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 12:43:27 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Klaus Roeder in Autobahn To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I've got a question from Ian Calder that I hadn't noticed before: "On the original copies of the 'Autobahn' LP, Klaus Roeder is credited with Violin and Guitar. To my ears, there is definitely guitar played on 'Autobahn' itself. (Yeah, that's right. I can also hear the guitar!). Presumably, by Klaus Roeder. So, what is puzzling is tat on the 1985 re-issues, Klaus Roeder is merely credited with Electric Violin on 'Mitternacht'. (That must be in the UK release, as in the German release, no credit is given to Roeder at all!). At no point does it refer to guitar. Yet, the guitar still seems to be on 'Autobahn'. So, is Mr. Roeder being short-changed as far as the credits go?! Or did Ralf or Florian play the guitar, like on earlier records?" Can anyone answer this? My guess is they have just changed the credits 'mistakenly' or sth. Jose Garcia pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 13:20:12 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Klaus Roeder in Autobahn To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu In message <199307131045.AA16899@cs.uwp.edu> you write: > Really-From: Jose Garcia > "On the original copies of the 'Autobahn' LP, Klaus Roeder is > credited with Violin and Guitar. To my ears, there is definitely > guitar played on 'Autobahn' itself. (Yeah, that's right. I can also > hear the guitar!). Presumably, by Klaus Roeder. > So, what is puzzling is tat on the 1985 re-issues, Klaus Roeder is > merely credited with Electric Violin on 'Mitternacht'. (That must > be in the UK release, as in the German release, no credit is given > to Roeder at all!). At no point does it refer to guitar. Yet, the > guitar still seems to be on 'Autobahn'. So, is Mr. Roeder being > short-changed as far as the credits go?! Or did Ralf or Florian play > the guitar, like on earlier records?" > > Can anyone answer this? My guess is they have just changed the > credits 'mistakenly' or sth. I think they re-recorded Autobahn exactly as it was, but that they played the guitar and violin and percussion themselves now. Thus it wasn't necessary any longer to mention Roeder, or Fluer for that matter. They also rewrote the lyrics as not having to mention Schult too! Note Mitternacht is a bit shorter on the cd than it was on the vinyl record. Did you know Conrad Plank died a few years ago, of lung cancer? For those who don't know the name: Plank was the guy who found and produced Kraftwerk and a number of other bands in the early 70's and 80's. Maybe his death was the cause for the rumours of Kraftwerkers being deceased, a few years ago. 'Connie's Studio' is/was a wellknown studio for German bands. Rick Jansen -- rick@sara.nl "Jetzt schalten wir ja das Radio ab... *click* ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 18:01:51 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Klaus Roeder in Autobahn To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Rick Jansen > I think they re-recorded Autobahn exactly as it was, but that > they played the guitar and violin and percussion themselves now. Really? > They also rewrote the lyrics as not having to > mention Schult too! Are the lyrics different??? Jose Garcia pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Jul 93 13:31:18 -0700 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #131 To: kraftwerk Really-From: karty@cs.washington.edu (Richard Karty) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > right McDatman? Were are you? John is here in Seattle for the summer. I doubt he has access to the Internet. We're supposed to hook up at some point... In fact, he blew me off when I had a barbeque last week :( BTW, John tells me he has a friend here who has an astonishingly huge Kraftwerk collection. I'd really like to see this! Richard ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jul 93 10:37:08 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Man Machine Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Gabriel Yedid > > I took the time a few days ago to go over The Man Machine. > I must prepare myself for a major flame-thrashing when I say I was not impressed. > It sounds like it was recorded in somebody's garage. How would that influence electronic sounds? ;-) > The Man Machine (the song) was completely incomprehensible--at any speed. Man Machine Thing and human being Man Machine Semi human being Mensch Machine Ein Wesen und ein Ding Die Mensch Machine Halb Wesen und halb Ueberding Rick Jansen -- rick@sara.nl She's a module and she's looking good ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 04:00:13 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #133 Kraftwerk Digest Thu, 15 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 133 Today's Topics: Disappointment Klaus Roeder in Autobahn logo for the KW digest? views on The Man Machine ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 13 Jul 1993 21:07:16 EST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: zerobeat@intacc.uucp (Ferenc Szabo) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Gabriel Yedid says (about Man Machine): >" It sounds like it was recorded in somebody's garage." Compared to The Mix, earlier KW albums are not as crisp, clean and noisefree. Man Machine was recorded in 1978, and not on THE BEST state-of-the-art equipment of the time. The original versions of The Mix songs are typically not as intense. RadioActivity is the most extreme example. But the older albums tend to be somewhat more 'dreamy' than The Mix. Of course the song 'Man Machine' doesn't give the same type of solid feeling that The Mix's 'The Robots' does. Even the original 'Robots' is not as intense, but it satisfies another element of my listening pleasure... it is more hypnotic and definitely more unique soundwise (The Mix follows more modern conventional mixing techniques, whereas the older records were quite alone) f-erenc *********************************************************** This message was sent from MATRIX (intacc.uucp) The views expressed in this posting those of the individual author only. *********************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1993 17:50:31 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Klaus Roeder in Autobahn To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Rick Jansen > I think they re-recorded Autobahn exactly as it was, ... > They also rewrote the lyrics as not having to > mention Schult too! I had a look at the credits of my Autobahn CD, and Schult is still credited! My CD is the German release. Jose Garcia "The number you have reached has been disconnected" pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jul 93 21:07 MET DST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: logo for the KW digest? To: kraftwerk Really-From: alex@hal.rhein-main.de (Alexander Lehmann) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Jose Garcia > Dave "administrator" Datta says he can add a tail logo to the digest... > > so: what about adding it? Maybe the now missed Hillebrand's autobahn sign? > And a quotation also? > > Thoughts from anyone? I'd say no. I don't see a point in adding to size of each digest post, since some recipients (incidentially including me) probably receive the list not at an universitiy, but at sites that have to pay for the mail they get. Assuming that a logo, quote and all takes about 2-3k, this would take up 1/3 of my monthly free mail volume (200k). If, on the other hand, everybody else is for a logo, I will not stand in the way. bye, Alexander --- Alexander Lehmann, alex@hal.rhein-main.de | "Wopp" or alexlehm@iti.informatik.th-darmstadt.de | - ( THHGTTG Pt.3 ) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 14 Jul 1993 12:48:43 -0400 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: views on The Man Machine To: kraftwerk Really-From: Ravindra S Shah Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Gabe's review of The Man Machine certainly sparked me to consider how I felt the first time I listened to it...ah memories... It was 1986 and I had just purchased the Electric Cafe cassette. My friend and I were amazed at the sounds coming from the car radio. We had never heard anything like it. I think I played the cassette 10 times on the drive from Pittsburgh to Chicago. This was my first time in Chicago, and I was really into "industrial" music, so I had to visit Wax Trax Records, half-expecting to see Alain Jourgensen. Leafing through the bargain bins we found two used Kraftwerk albums, Trans Europe Express and The Man Machine. I picked The Man Machine because the cover was so...artsy (artful I would argue). Upon my return from Chicago I ran in the house and started playing the album. I was extremely surprised that a record could make the woofers bounce like they did; I had just gotten a CD player for graduation, on which I used to play Pink Floyd's The Wall at uncomfortable sound levels. But this crisp, clean sound came from a record (a used one at that). I was further surprised by how future-oriented the record was; the songs sounded like they could have been made in 1986. At the time, my favorite song was The Robots. Now it is The Man Machine. Yes, I do like it, because it is repetitve--genius repeated is still genius. The layering of the sounds is outstanding, and the Cartesean theme just makes it better. At some time I thought that TMM was a step backwards from flowing feel to TEE, but I don't think so anymore. Electric Cafe got me hooked on KW and TMM made me an enthusiast. Sorry this has been so long. Ravi Shah shah+@pitt.edu "Ich bin der Musikant mit 'Palmtop' in der Hand" ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 04:00:11 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #134 Kraftwerk Digest Fri, 16 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 134 Today's Topics: bye (for short I hope) CEMA vs Capitol Man Machine Disappointment (2 msgs) Sound quality, was: Re: Disappointment (4 msgs) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 13:07:44 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: bye (for short I hope) To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I'm no longer subscribed to this list :-( We're moving to another building and I don't know when we'll be disconnected from the net, but it'll happen soon (maybe Friday 16). I might have access to the net soon again, don't know. If anyone wants to get in touch with me, e-mail to me directly. I hope I'll crosstalk to you soon again. I'll miss the list ;-( , , Jose Garcia "The number you have reached has been disconnected" pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 12:07:37 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: CEMA vs Capitol Man Machine To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Nope, it was definitely the Capitol version I heard. Gabe. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 12:56:37 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jose Garcia Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Gabriel Yedid About the Man Machine album: > It sounds like it was recorded in somebody's garage. You must have the CEMA re-release! I compared the Capitol release and the CEMA one to find the sound quality is superior in the Capitol release. In the CEMA one, the background noise is not as noticeable as in the Capitol one. The sound loses the original definition though. I compared this on the start of Neon Lights (one of the highlights of the album IMO). The sound of the rythm track is much poorer on the CEMA release. Any other opinions about the sound quality? I'd like to compare the Capitol CD with the original LP. I'll do so... Gabe, is it the CEMA release the one you have? Jose Garcia "The number you have reached has been disconnected" pepe@cti.uab.es ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 12:52:35 -0400 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Ravindra S Shah Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Jose Garcia > Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > > About the Man Machine album: [] > > Any other opinions about the sound quality? > [] > I'd like to compare the Capitol CD with the original LP. I'll do so... > [] When I bought the CD for TMM, I was unimpressed by the sound quality. The record is definitely more lively than the CD. I believe I have the Capitol release, not CEMA. I just attribute it to poor digital mastering. I have a number of CDs that have the same "dull and tinny" sound. Ravi Shah shah+@pitt.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Jul 93 13:47:50 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sound quality, was: Re: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Any other opinions about the sound quality? Some tracks on Kraftwerk records before The Mix contain quite a lot of noise. Especially Showroom Dummies and The Robots. Use a pair of headphones and hear the noisy microphone being switched on and off in Showroom Dummies, and the 'tee tee tee tee' sound and vocoded stuff in The Robots. Who cares anyway, noise is part of electronic music ;-) Rick Jansen -- rick@sara.nl Boo! Hiss! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 13:57:04 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sound quality, was: Re: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Peter de Waal Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu In message <199307151149.AA23882@cs.uwp.edu>you write: > Who cares anyway, noise is part of electronic music ;-) Tsss. Dan snap ik toch niet waarom je in je Formant niet doodgewone 741-tjes gestopt hebt... En die VCO die eerst niet perfect stil te krijgen was? Zouden we eindelijk eens wat rust krijgen nu Jose afgesloten is? --- Peter --- "I act vulgar. She *is* vulgar." (Dietrich about Madonna) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1993 12:10:40 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sound quality, was: Re: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu On Thu, 15 Jul 1993, kraftwerk mailing list wrote: > Really-From: Rick Jansen > Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > > > > Any other opinions about the sound quality? > > Some tracks on Kraftwerk records before The Mix contain > quite a lot of noise. Especially Showroom Dummies and > The Robots. Use a pair of headphones and hear the noisy > microphone being switched on and off in Showroom Dummies, > and the 'tee tee tee tee' sound and vocoded stuff in > The Robots. > > Who cares anyway, noise is part of electronic music ;-) Well, I don't think so. My Jarre and Vangelis records from the same period (1976-1980) sound clean as a whistle (except for dust and minor scratches), MUCH better than TMM. There is clearly a different recording standard at work, especially in Jarre's case. Does KW still use vocording, or have they switched to sampling? I'm pretty sure that you can do everything with the latter you can with the former (Jarre's Zoolook as the sampling Bible I swear on...). Gabe ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 10:16:36 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sound quality, was: Re: Disappointment To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Well, I don't think so. My Jarre and Vangelis records from the same > period (1976-1980) sound clean as a whistle (except for dust and minor > scratches), MUCH better than TMM. There is clearly a different recording > standard at work, especially in Jarre's case. I guess you can't have everything. Kraftwerk are independent and probably invested more in their instruments and new ways of making music than getting THE very best recording system. I really don't care if there's a bit of noise in there, as long as it doesn't get worse, as with vinyl records. I find it charming in a way even, it shows their kind of 'rough' manner of recording. There is somethimg strange in both my Computerworld lp and cd though, one of the channels sounds kind of numb for a few seconds and ok again after. I'll listen to it at home and report. Rick Jansen -- rick@sara.nl "Vorsprung durch Technik" ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Sat, 17 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #135 Kraftwerk Digest Sat, 17 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 135 Today's Topics: Mailing list Regarding noise in KW music ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 15:08 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Mailing list To: kraftwerk Really-From: KLEE@mail.kentlaw.edu (KYONG LEE) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Please add me to this mailing list. THanks~ *************************************************************************** Kyong I. Lee Chicago-Kent College of Law klee@mail.kentlaw.edu Illinois Institute of Technology *************************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Jul 93 08:13:34 EDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Regarding noise in KW music To: kraftwerk Really-From: Richard=Paiement%DCN%DGBT=CRC=ADMSR@dgbt.banyan.doc.ca Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Rick Jansen writes: >Who cares anyway, noise is part of electronic music ;-) Unlike others who have responded in disagreement with this comment, I totally agree with Rick. I have no problem with noise as long as it is part of the recording. However, a dirty or scratched vinyl record does get on my nerves. I remember being blown away by the clearness of sounds on Computer World (LP) when I first bought it. I was oh so careful with this album, because I knew that just one small scratch would be quite obvious in the playback and might just ruin the experience. This was way back when it was released, unlike with other posters who have gone back in the KW catalogue after discovering The Mix. I can understand that these folks could be disappointed in the given circumstance, but not me. I also find that TMM CD has more noise than the LP, but this may be due to the nature of the medium. CD tends to reveal much more than cassette or LP, be it musical or defect. New sounds being switched on can be anticipated even before the sound is heard because another noise layer is be heard. This to me does not make it unlistenable or bad. In fact, my first reaction was to laugh, thinking about what technology they used at the time. I still love the album. Yea, sure, maybe other groups have had better sound quality (JMM and TD have been mentioned), but I don't find it that important, as long as the sound quality is better than what can be found on ELP albums ;-). One of my favorite comparison albums is King Crimson's first LP, In the Court of the Crimson King, released in 1969. I have a copy of the re-mastered CD, and to me that examplifies incredible production and sound quality for the times (I'm not talking of the music style). I can't respond to the following, though it seems to be about VCOs not being perfect and other stuff: >Tsss. Dan snap ik toch niet waarom je in je Formant niet doodgewone >741-tjes gestopt hebt... En die VCO die eerst niet perfect stil te >krijgen was? > >Zouden we eindelijk eens wat rust krijgen nu Jose afgesloten is? Richard.Paiement@crc.doc.ca "Chaise et mode? Elle? Anche disloque en gouda!" :-( ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Sun, 18 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #136 Kraftwerk Digest Sun, 18 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 136 Today's Topics: Vocoding (2 msgs) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1993 13:05:25 -0400 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Vocoding To: kraftwerk Really-From: Tina Marie LeMarier Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu In order for Kraftwerk (or Jarre, for that matter) to sample there must first be a sound to sample. So I think that it would be pretty safe to say that they are still vocoding. I would also consider it safe to say that they then sample the vocoded work so they can sequence it. Samplers are not magic, although they seem like it sometimes. But by its self a sampler makes no sound without input. Shane King (proud owner of a new sampler!) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Jul 1993 14:41:56 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Vocoding To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu On Sat, 17 Jul 1993, kraftwerk mailing list wrote: > Really-From: Tina Marie LeMarier > Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > > In order for Kraftwerk (or Jarre, for that matter) to sample there must > first be a sound to sample. I knew that already. >So I think that it would be pretty safe to > say that they are still vocoding. I would also consider it safe to say > that they then sample the vocoded work so they can sequence it. But to sample an INSTRUMENT, can you not play it directly into the sampler? I'm quite sure Jarre did not vocord the sax sound for use on Les Chants Magetiques before sampling it on his Fairlight. Or are keyboards with built-in samplers a luxury that KW does without? > Samplers are not magic, although they seem like it sometimes. But > by its self a sampler makes no sound without input. > > Shane King (proud owner of a new sampler!) What kind? Gabe ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Mon, 19 Jul 93 04:00:09 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #137 Kraftwerk Digest Mon, 19 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 137 Today's Topics: Help! Sampling ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 19 Jul 1993 09:07:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Help! To: kraftwerk Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193000 93-07-19 09.07 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET Does anyone on the list know Andrew Sleght from Bath? I met him at Brixton Academy at the last Kraftwerk concert 1991. He has written some articles in Activitet. I have lost his adress, if anyone knows him, please mail me. /Anders (dvlawmIcs.umu.se) "We are computer servants, programmed to obey" - Trafo 1991. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 18 Jul 1993 20:43:20 -0400 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Sampling To: kraftwerk Really-From: Tina Marie LeMarier Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I'm not sure of that Jarre cut, it's one of the few albums I don't have. The fairlight DID have waveforms in its memory. The main use of the Fairlight was for these sounds, and sampling was actually thrown in as an afterthought! As for myself I have the Peavey SP/SXII combo, and I like it alot! Shane King ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Tue, 20 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #138 Kraftwerk Digest Tue, 20 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 138 Today's Topics: Mystery man on Radioactvity picture ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 19 Jul 1993 22:59:27 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Mystery man on Radioactvity picture To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I saw a copy of CEMA's release of Radioactivity today, the one with a picture of the band on it. I recognized three of the four members (Ralf, Florian, and Karl), but there is a fourth one with a bit longer hair than the others. Who is this--Wolfgang Flur or Emil Schult? (It sort of doesn't look like Flur) Gabe ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Thu, 22 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #139 Kraftwerk Digest Thu, 22 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 139 Today's Topics: Kraftwerk video mistery man (2 msgs) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 21 Jul 1993 11:17:33 -0400 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Kraftwerk video To: kraftwerk Really-From: MCINTYRE@MSUPA.PA.MSU.EDU Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu There was a record show in town this weekend. Spent way too much money, but found some good stuff. The real treasure so far is a videotape of Kraftwerk. The dealer said it contained all the available video, and he might be right. It contains the promos for "The Model" (low budget, lots of stock footage), "Pocket Calculator" (mostly in concert footage"), "Music Non-Stop" (nice computer graphics), and "The Telephone Call". There's a brief French TV bit from 1991, and two songs from Sellafield 1992: "The Robots" and "Radioactivity". Lots of in concert footage in the Sellafield spots as well as some politicizing. But the real gem is the first piece: "Truckstop Gondolero" from the Beat Club. The tape says it's from 1973, but I suspect it might be earlier, as it has Klaus Dinger on drums, and he was only on the first album circa 1970. _Autobahn_ was 1974, and "Truckstop Gondolero" is very different in style. Florian Schneider is playing a lot of flute and only the simplest of synthesizer sounds. The big surprise is Ralf Hutter is absent. Guest guitar is supplied by Michael Rother, who naturally fits right in. There's some real cheezy video effects that remind me of the shows my band Totentanz used to do on public access cable. Just amazing to think that that performance exists today. Sigh, positive reinforcement for spending money I don't have yet. Not what I needed. 8-) "Truckstop Gondolero", though, that I *did* need. John McIntyre Physics - Astronomy Domine Dept Michigan State University ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Jul 93 14:24:03 METDST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: mistery man To: kraftwerk Really-From: "H." Boorsma Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > Really-From: Gabriel Yedid > Who is this--Wolfgang Flur or Emil Schult? It is Schult. BTW, you can find this info in the biography 'Man machine & music' that was released a few months ago & was reviewed on the list.... Hillebrand ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 93 10:17:46 N From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: mistery man To: kraftwerk Really-From: Rick Jansen Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > > Who is this--Wolfgang Flur or Emil Schult? > > It is Schult. If we're talking about the picture of 4 men, with Huetter wearing DAC's cheesy german shepard tie it is Fluer. Schult is the one tucked away in the corner of the radio aerial picture, holding paintbrushes and pencils and the lot and NOT a screwdriver as Man Machine and Music states. Man Machine and Music says a lot more silly things, but thats for a later note. Rick Jansen -- rick@sara.nl "Silly silly silly! I'm going to stop this sketch now." ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Fri, 23 Jul 93 04:00:11 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #140 Kraftwerk Digest Fri, 23 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 140 Today's Topics: AKTIVITAET issue 4 Information (3 msgs) Information Society (2 msgs) InfoSoc trafo-ruhr What happened to the video? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 22 Jul 1993 12:10:08 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: AKTIVITAET issue 4 To: kraftwerk Really-From: IINF9@cc.uab.es Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Hi, I've managed to access an account from wich I can send mail. Please DO NOT send mail to this address, as it's not my account. I've missed having access to the list, as I haven't been able to join the interesting discussion about the Man Machine, noise, and so on. Anyway, here's some info about the next issue of the unofficial fanzine AKTIVITAET that I was sent by Ian Calder. The fanzine will be available in the first week of August. Articles to be included are: * 'Activity', a round up of latest releases/news etc; * an article detailing Kraftwerk promo video's from 1972-1978; * a translation of an interview with Ralf Hutter originally printed in the Dutch fanzine KLEM in 1991; * an article giving details of the various vinyl LP bootlegs on the go; * a review of the bands most recent concerts at the end of May; * a report on the Kraftwerk convention held in Blackpool back in January; * news on Karl Bartos' band Elektric Music; * an article detailing various items of Kraftwerk memorabilia; * 'Feedback', a readers letters section; * a 'Collectors Corner' on releases from the USA; and more. It will be A5 sized, with 48 pages plus a b&w cover. Cost is 2 UK pounds plus postage costs. To order copies write to: AKTIVITAET 108 Cummings Park Crescent ABERDEEN AB2 7AR SCOTLAND, U.K. Please enclose an IRC or SAE with all correspondence. On another note: > Really-From: Peter de Waal > Tsss. Dan snap ik toch niet waarom je in je Formant niet doodgewone > 741-tjes gestopt hebt... En die VCO die eerst niet perfect stil te > Zouden we eindelijk eens wat rust krijgen nu Jose afgesloten is? Could you be as kind enough as to translate the mail you sent to this list some digests ago, Peter? Now that I have the chance, some more comments. Ravi, I liked your post about 'views on The Man Machine'. I agree totally about the astonishing complex structure and sounds of it. No matter about the noise. The important is 'what' and not 'how'. Anders, I think Ian Calder has Andrew's address. Write to him. Gabe, it's Fluer the guy you see on the back cover of CEMA's Radioactivity. Anything else? I won't have access to my account until late August, early September. I will get the digests though, so I'll be able to read what you post to the list. That's it for now. Jose Garcia "The number you have reached has been disconnected" ** please DO NOT MAIL to the address on the heading ** ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 1993 14:09:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Information To: kraftwerk Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193044 93-07-22 14.09 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET In loads of interviews they have said that they are very influenced by Kraftwerk, they have got a very funky version of Numbers on the 12"-version of the ABBA-cover "Lay all your love on me". They have got alot of very good material, they have also, in my opinion, loads of quite bad material. But the good parts is worth looking for. /anders "Watch the war, on the screen, it is safe, it is clean." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 93 13:35:33 BST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Information To: kraftwerk Really-From: kzim@ucrmath.ucr.edu (christopher zimmerman) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > In loads of interviews they have said that they are very > influenced by Kraftwerk, they have got a very funky version > of Numbers on the 12"-version of the ABBA-cover "Lay all > your love on me". ...if that's what you want to call it. I call it a remake of their own track, "Make It Funky," with a slowed-down "Numbers" sample thrown in. Really, so many people have lifted "Numbers" that I wouldn't even call it an original thing to do. Christopher Robin Zimmerman ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 1993 19:32:49 -0700 (PDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Information To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jonathan Komar Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu The b-side of INSOC's "Lay all of your love on me" really isn't a remake of Numbers. That song called "Make it Funkier" is a remix of another song from the first album called "Make it Funky". Although the remix has a Kraftwerk sound to it, I don't think is was ment to be a remake. Jonthan Komar ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 93 13:54:56 METDST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Information Society To: kraftwerk Really-From: "H." Boorsma Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu A few months ago I bought in the Rotterdam record shop 'Plato' a CD from a group called 'Information Society', titled 'Hack', subtitled 'Hackers of the world unite!'. It was only a few guilders, the cover looked funny, it put it in my CD player, disliked it, and threw it in the deep vaults of my record collection. But, when I was painting my shower this morning, it slipped in my CD player again and it rang a bell! Then I looked at the cover, saw a track called: 'Wenn Wellen schwingen' ( including Russian radio noises). So I listened more carefully, and heard 'Eins Zwei Drei Vier' in the track following WWS and noises from 'The Robots' in the track 'Hack 1'. I still dont't like the album very much. There are some nice tracks, but the mayor part of the longer songs are kind of 2nd class Human League. But, there are some interesting experimental intro's, including modem and metal sounds. And some nice dance things too. Can anyone tell me more about Information Society ? It appears to be an American band, with the management in NY and a fanclub in California. Have they made more (better) records ? Do they quote KW more often ? Hillebrand ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 1993 19:27:41 -0700 (PDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Information Society To: kraftwerk Really-From: Jonathan Komar Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Information Society has been one of my favorite bands ever since their first album came out in 1989. I'll have to agree that their second alumb called "Hack" is not one of their best. However, they just came out with a new album this year called "Peace and Love, Inc.", which is a very good album, and includes Kraftwerk like songs. One particullar song that we all can appreciate is called "Where would I be without my IBM". I just recently went to their concert here in Southern California only a couple of months ago and was very impressed by their performance. I'm sure there are other Kraftwerk fans who are also INSOC fans. Jonthan Komar ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 1993 21:50:38 -0500 (EST) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: InfoSoc To: kraftwerk Really-From: 00gdwessel@leo.bsuvc.bsu.edu Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Personally, I kinda dig InfoSoc, with the so-called accursed HACK being my favorite... Not too big a fan of PEACE AND LOVE INC., but hey, that's just me.... btw if MY info. is correct, a dude from rec.music.industrial once told me that the members of InfoSoc have been hanging out lately with Karl Bartos....hmmmm... --- We@sel Geoff Wessel, 00GDWESSEL@LEO.BSUVC.BSU.EDU ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 1993 15:01:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: trafo-ruhr To: kraftwerk Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193044 93-07-22 15.01 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET At last we have managed to get all material ready for the first CD release from Transformator Station. We have been working on the material for about 3 years, for those who has heard us before, the songs appearing on the CD will be: ruhr ether trafo elektron kommunikation computer servants Those who want to pre-order it, send me a mail, and I'll send you more info. /anders email to trafoIunitech.se or dvlawmIcs.umu.se ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Jul 1993 21:10:53 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: What happened to the video? To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Was that video snippit on MTV really a preview, or just something to toy with our emotions and get hopes up falsely? Any news on it or a new album? Gabe ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Sat, 24 Jul 93 04:00:10 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #141 Kraftwerk Digest Sat, 24 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 141 Today's Topics: Slightly Different ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 23 Jul 1993 13:58:56 EST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Slightly Different To: kraftwerk Really-From: Bruce_M._Lloyd@magic-bbs.corp.apple.com Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Onto something slightly different, does anyone know about the German band Ledernacken & Band? I have a few of their earlier works, and they are rather good (sort of a thrash sounding punk style from the early 80s). Anyone know if they're still around? The telephone number on the back of their first album doesn't work anymore. bml ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Sun, 25 Jul 93 04:00:08 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #142 Kraftwerk Digest Sun, 25 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 142 Today's Topics: Information Society Wanted: CD Single ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 24 Jul 1993 20:50:38 -0400 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Information Society To: kraftwerk Really-From: Tina Marie LeMarier Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I would tend to discount the rumours that Info Society has been hanging around with Bartos, unless Bartos is living in San Francisco. There is now only one member of Insoc, and he's been busy moving and stuff. (I have this from Kurt himself, the singer) But Kraftwerk has been an influence on him, and there are a couple of songs with Krafwerk samples in it. Sampling Krafwerk is fun. It's the first thing that I did when I got my sampler! Shane King ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Jul 93 08:28:10 PDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Wanted: CD Single To: kraftwerk Really-From: meistro@pro-nsdapple.cts.com (Brian Plume) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Hi there. This is my first message to the Digest, so please be patient. I am looking for the CD single to Kraftwerk's "Radioactivity". It has remixes from Francois Kevorkian, William Orbit, as well as the version from "The Mix" CD. If anyone knows where I can purchase this CD single, please let me know. Thanx. ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Tue, 27 Jul 93 04:00:11 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #143 Kraftwerk Digest Tue, 27 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 143 Today's Topics: Kraftwerk video ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 26 Jul 1993 11:31:35 -0400 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Kraftwerk video To: kraftwerk Really-From: MCINTYRE@MSUPA.PA.MSU.EDU Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Earlier I had posted about the Kraftwerk videotape that I picked up at a recent record show and had mentioned the strange personnel on the first cut: "Truckstop Gondoler" with Florian Schneider ( and *not* Ralf Hutter) and Klaus Dinger and Michael Rother. I mentioned that I doubted the date on the label (1973) as Klaus Dinger only appeared on the first Kraftwerk album and that was dated as 1970. And Michael Rother had never been a member of Kraftwerk to my knowledge. After thinking about this, the thought accured that Neu was in existance in 1973. Neu being Klaus Dinger, formerly of Kraftwerk, and Michael Rother, and I would greatly appreciate any history of him prior to Neu. I checked my shelves of vinyl, and sure enough, the first Neu album came out in 1972 and the second in 1973. (The third was released in 1975, but they had added two more members by then.) So my guess is that "Truckstop Gondoler" is more properly described as Neu with Florian Schneider sitting in rather than Kraftwerk with Klaus Dinger and Michael Rother sitting in. However, the onscreen credit is definately to Kraftwerk, so whomsoever compiled the tape is innocent. 8-) Heck, let's be honest. He's a bootlegger; he (she or it) is guilty as hell; and I say, Gods bless them for making this available. OK, folks. Here is your chance to editorialize. As a recording artist (albeit with a label in Italy) I am advocating bootlegging. Well, yeah, the guy who sells my music for a profit and does not give me a cut is scum. I have no qualms about saying that. But given the possibilities: a) my music is purchased through legimate channels and I am reimbursed for the hearing of my music, b) my music is bootleged through illegimate channels and I receive no compensation for my music, all profits go to the bloodsucking bootlegger, and c) my music is never distributed, never heard. Well, a) is obviously the preferable. c) is the worst case. Therefore, I will settle for b). At it's idealistic best b) includes cases such as the AllMusic compilation. Grumble, no one included *my* music on the AllMusic compilation tape. Oh well, I'll get my revenge on the DIY tape. 8-) So to make my point obvious: yeah, it would be nice to be paid for people hearing my music. But it is better that people hear my music and I not get paid than for me to not get paid and people not hear my music. [I do yield to the people that their preference might well be that they do not pay and do not hear. 8-)] Hmm, I fear I have lost more than one reader. My original intent was to say that one could quibble as to whether or not "Truckstop Gondoler" was Kraftwerk or Neu. It would have helped if either band had used that song title, but an examination of my vinyl collection reveals no usage of that title by either band. So you be the judge. My own guess is Neu plus Florian, with the TV program crediting it to Kraftwerk with the idea that Kraftwerk was the bigger name. But that is just a guess. I have a hard time imagining Kraftwerk without Ralf Hutter. The most favorable guesss I can come up with is the show booked Kraftwerk, Ralf took ill, and Florian called on Klaus Dinger for help. I would appreciate information from someone who has better sources than I, which equates to the album jackets. John McIntyre Physics - Astronomy Domine Dept Michigan State University ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Wed, 28 Jul 93 04:00:12 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #144 Kraftwerk Digest Wed, 28 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 144 Today's Topics: A crack at the lyrics for Dentaku Bedtime for Bo ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 20:14:13 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: A crack at the lyrics for Dentaku To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Seeing as the lyrics for Dentaku available via FTP are none too impressive, here is, I hope, a correct phonetic transliteration: Bokuwa konga-ka, dentaku kadatinyi, (x2) Dashi-tari, Ihi-tari, So sashteh, Sakyubusu! Konobotam, oseba, ongaku kanaderu (x2) These are the lyrics from the version presented on The Mix. Hope it satisfies Hillebrand... Gabe ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Jul 1993 13:45:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Bedtime for Bo To: kraftwerk Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193044 93-07-27 13.45 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET Has anyone heard the group Bedtime for Bonzo? I heard of them a couple of years ago, being described as doing Kraftwerk-like music. I have never heard them though... /anders (dvlawmIcs.umu.se) ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Thu, 29 Jul 93 04:00:11 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #145 Kraftwerk Digest Thu, 29 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 145 Today's Topics: Kraftwerk-wanna Be (2 msgs) Robotic Remixes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1993 13:17:15 EST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Kraftwerk-wanna Be To: kraftwerk Really-From: Bruce_M._Lloyd@magic-bbs.corp.apple.com Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu If you haven't already, go pick up the CD by the group "Recoil". Its the keyboardist from Depeche Mode (Alan Wilder) and the vocalist from Nitzer Ebb (name$ McArthy?). There is one track (something "bloodline") that is _SO_ Kraftwerk that I had to wonder if Kraftwerk wrote it. I counted about 11 different things in that were Kraftwerk. A beat from Trans-Europe Express, an effect from The Robots a la Mix, vocoder voice effect from any Kraftwerk song ..... it goes on and on! Pick it up! bml ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Jul 1993 12:44:42 +1000 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Kraftwerk-wanna Be To: kraftwerk Really-From: mcelwee@cc.uow.edu.au (Bennett) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > If you haven't already, go pick up the CD by the group "Recoil". Its the > keyboardist from Depeche Mode (Alan Wilder) and the vocalist from Nitzer > Ebb (name$ McArthy?). Actually the "group" is just Alan Wilder with various guest vocalists helping out...and the album you're talking about is called "Bloodline". > There is one track (something "bloodline") that is _SO_ Kraftwerk that I > had to wonder if Kraftwerk wrote it. I counted about 11 different things > in that were Kraftwerk. A beat from Trans-Europe Express, an effect from > The Robots a la Mix, vocoder voice effect from any Kraftwerk song ..... it > goes on and on! Yes, he samples a _lot_ of stuff, mostly Depeche Mode but also lots of other stuff (like Kraftwerk). Recoil is very KW-influenced (but then, aren't we all?). > Pick it up! I definitely concur. It's an excellent album. And as a bit more of a fascinating Kraftwerk connection, Recoil's single "Faith Healer" contains a remix by LFO, who have worked with Elektric Music! Wheee! -- == Bennett ========================================= mcelwee@cc.uow.edu.au == | | | I want to be free, like a bird and a bee! | ============================================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Jul 1993 22:52:35 -500 (EDT) From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Robotic Remixes To: kraftwerk Really-From: Gabriel Yedid Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu What exactly are the contents of The Robots single disc that was released to go with The Mix? The "Robotronik" and "Robotnik" tracks seem, in their length, comparable to the version from The Mix, and the song itself (the last track) is less than 4 minutes long. Is it one continuous piece, or is each track a variation on the song, with one no-frills version at the end? Also, I just want to know: who does the singing on The Mix? Is it Ralf or Florian, or both? Does Fritz sing at all? Gabe ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Fri, 30 Jul 93 04:00:11 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #146 Kraftwerk Digest Fri, 30 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 146 Today's Topics: Recoil (2 msgs) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 29 Jul 93 08:33:35 PDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Recoil To: kraftwerk Really-From: meistro@pro-nsdapple.cts.com (Brian Plume) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu I see you guyz are mentioning REcoil on here.....well, Bloodline is the 2nd album that Alan Wilder has done. His first is pretty rare to find, but if you do, GRAB it! It is mostly synth/experimental stuff. I love it. Alan Wilder said Kraftwerk is his biggest influence in the musik he does. He also went to one of their Koncerts a couple of years ago. Just thought you would like to know.....hehehe. Oh, the name of his first Cd is entitled, "Hydrology 1 + 2", and contains songs: 1) Grain 2) Stone 3) Sermon 4) 1 + 2 Sure, it LOOKS like the album is a complete WASTE, but I think 3 of the 4 sons are over 10 minutes long!!!!!!! GO OUT THERE AND GET THIS! Oh, and the song you are talking about that sounds like Kraftwerk WROTE is called "The Defector". Brian ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Jul 93 13:48:46 BST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Recoil To: kraftwerk Really-From: kzim@ucrmath.ucr.edu (christopher zimmerman) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > I see you guyz are mentioning REcoil on here.....well, Bloodline is > the 2nd album that Alan Wilder has done. His first is pretty rare > to find, but if you do, GRAB it! > Oh, the name of his first Cd is entitled, "Hydrology 1 + 2", and contains > songs: > 4 sons are over 10 minutes long!!!!!!! GO OUT THERE AND GET THIS! > Brian I'm sure someone else will correct you on this, but Alan Wilder released TWO albums before "Bloodline" on Mute, the first being " 1 + 2 ", and the second being "Hydrology." I would consider them both EPs. At the time it was released, one of my friends joked that the first album could have been called "Further Excerpts From Depeche Mode," because a goodly amount of what you heard were Mode samples. I have both albums, and highly recommend the first one (though with less exclamation points than Brian), and would marginally recommend the second one. If they're both on the same disc, then great. "1+2" on vinyl is great though, because you can play it at 45 or 33, depending on what mood you're in. ;-) Oh yeah, the "Faithhealer" Maxi-CD is a must have also. The LFO mixes are awesome. OBKraftwerk: Isn't that a cool picture sleve for the "Pocket Calculator" single? (Sorry, it's the best thing I could come up with) Christopher Robin Zimmerman a regular at the Electic Cafe ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ****************************** Date: Sat, 31 Jul 93 04:00:11 CDT From: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu Reply-To: kraftwerk@cs.uwp.edu (Kraftwerk) Subject: Kraftwerk Digest V1 #147 Kraftwerk Digest Sat, 31 Jul 93 Volume 1 : Issue 147 Today's Topics: computer aktivitaet Jose! re: REcoil (2 msgs) Synthesizer question ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1993 13:16:13 GMT+0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: computer aktivitaet To: kraftwerk Really-From: IINF9@cc.uab.es Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Hello again folks. Still don't have access to an account, but I've managed to mail this, so please DO NOT MAIL to the address that appears on the header, it's not my own account! > Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" > > At last we have managed to get all material ready for the > first CD release from Transformator Station. Anders, sounds very KWish. Can you send some more info to the list? > Really-From: MCINTYRE@MSUPA.PA.MSU.EDU > > So my guess is that "Truckstop Gondoler" is more properly described as Neu > with Florian Schneider sitting in rather than Kraftwerk with Klaus Dinger and > Michael Rother sitting in. ... > My own guess is Neu plus Florian, ... The info I have about this is from the book "KW. Man, machine & music". According to Pascal Bussy, this video is from 1970, after the relese of "KW". It says that Ralf left the band for some months, and KW was Florian, Klaus Dinger and M. Rother for some time. Curiously, there's a bootleg LP with a concert in Koeln recorded in 1971 and D.A.C. Crowell recognised Rother on it. So it must be this line-up that played in Koeln (for more info browse in the back issues of the digest). Some months later, Ralf joined the band and KW were then Ralf & Florian. Rother and Dinger formed Neu! and they used some of the stuff that was recorded in some sessions within KW as source of some of their tracks (again, see back issues of the digest). > Really-From: Gabriel Yedid > > What exactly are the contents of The Robots single disc that was > released to go with The Mix? The contents of it is not one continuous piece but 2 different mixes and a third one which is one of these 2 but shorter. The remixex are quite different and I recommend you pick it up. > Also, I just want to know: who does the singing on The Mix? It's Ralf the one who sings. Fritz doesn't sing, as far as I know. Florian used to sing the vocoded stuff, even live (the last time was in the C. World tour). Well that's it for the moment. I'm looking forward to have again an account with access to the internet. Jose Garcia "The number you have reached has been disconnected" ** please DO NOT MAIL to the address on the header ** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Jul 1993 13:55:00 +0200 From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Jose! To: kraftwerk Really-From: "ICA.ICASTO1.P00AWM" Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu --- Inkommet fren ICASTO1.P00AWM +46 21 193044 93-07-30 13.55 -> ERI.VAX."KRAFTWERK..CS.UWP.EDU"..INET..EDS -: - - - - - - - - - - > USER IN MEMONET Please mail me your post-adress and I'll airmail you information about Trafo. /anders (dvlawmIcs.umu.se) - I hope you have been blessed by this program. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Jul 93 09:03:55 PDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: re: REcoil To: kraftwerk Really-From: meistro@pro-nsdapple.cts.com (Brian Plume) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu >I'm sure someone else will correct you on this, but Alan Wilder released >TWO albums before "Bloodline" on Mute, the first being " 1 + 2 ", and the >second being "Hydrology." I would consider them both EPs. I'm a bit confused about your reply, Sir. I SAID that Alan Wilder had an album before Bloodline, and I gave the correct names and everything....I've got Hydrology 1 + 2 on CD, so I don't know what you are correcting me for. If you consider them EPs, then so be it, but please don't correct me for something that I said that was RIGHT. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Jul 93 12:01:24 BST From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: re: REcoil To: kraftwerk Really-From: kzim@ucrmath.ucr.edu (christopher zimmerman) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu > >I'm sure someone else will correct you on this, but Alan Wilder released > >TWO albums before "Bloodline" on Mute, the first being " 1 + 2 ", and the > >second being "Hydrology." I would consider them both EPs. > > I'm a bit confused about your reply, Sir. > > I SAID that Alan Wilder had an album before Bloodline, and > I gave the correct names and everything....I've got Hydrology 1 + 2 on > CD, so I don't know what you are correcting me for. If you consider them > EPs, then so be it, but please don't correct me for something that I > said that was RIGHT. I swear I'm not gonna waste any more bandwidth on this after this reply. They are two separate albums, released months apart. Whether or not they are both released on the same disc, they are still two separate releases and you may want to listen to the entire disc with that in mind. Please send all flames to me directly and not to the Kraftwerk list. Christopher Robin Zimmerman, kzim@ucrmath.ucr.edu a regular at the Electric Cafe. PS If anyone has one of these CDs they'd like to sell me, I'd be very interested in it. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 30 Jul 93 14:07:41 EDT From: kraftwerk (kraftwerk mailing list) Subject: Synthesizer question To: kraftwerk Really-From: eric@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu (Eric J. Hansen) Requests for add/removal from this list to kraftwerk-request@cs.uwp.edu Hi, all... this is kind of a random question, but I figure it's not too out-of line. Anyways, I am a loyal KW fan, of course, but I also play keyboards. I know that there are at least several folks on this list who fall into the same category, so I have a question for you! Does anyone have any opinions which they can give me on the *Korg M1* synthesizer? From a musician's point of view, I'd like to know what you think (i.e., feel, sounds, comparison to other synths, etc, etc.) Does KW use this on anything? Pardon if this is borderline-off-the-subject, but I have the opportunity to buy a Korg M1 used, and I want some opinions (other than my own, of course). Email would probably be best. Thanks very much, Eric Hansen eric@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu *---------------------------------------------------------------------* | Eric J. Hansen .................... eric@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu | | Center for Clinical Computing .......... Boston, MA (617) 732-5925 | | .... DOS/Mac programming, Ultrix administration, general chaos .... | *---------------------------------------------------------------------* ------------------------------ End of Kraftwerk Digest ******************************